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#1 2017-06-01 00:05:06

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Ugh....

Question:
What's worse than Florida at the beginning of June?


Answer:
Florida at the beginning of June with no air conditioning.  UGH.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#2 2017-06-01 00:10:33

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

PS:  Yes, I know the answers "Florida at the end of June, beginning of July, August, September..."  or pretty much any time other than those few days in February when it's actually nice in this Guardians-forsaken hellhole of a state, are also valid answers.  But they didn't get across my point.


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#3 2017-06-01 00:27:36

Augur
Wasted
Registered: 2012-08-23
Posts: 104

Re: Ugh....

Use a ventilator at your place. Cheaper than AC, while having a very refreshing effect. If it works in South America, it should certainly work in Florida.

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#4 2017-06-01 03:35:05

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

Not sure exactly what you mean by a "ventilator", but it sounds an awful lot like "a fan in an open window".

If this is what you mean, then it blows chunks, HARD, here in Florida.  Moving 90-degree air is no more refreshing than stagnant 90-degree air.  The temperature here hit 96 degrees today.  The temperature in the house was 90. We have fans all over our house.  They did NOT help.

Thankfully, the AC repair guy was out and "fixed" it.  (I put that in quotes because there is no way to make this unit work 100% anymore: it's too old.)

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#5 2017-06-01 06:49:46

Sniper
Inebriated
Registered: 2016-07-04
Posts: 94

Re: Ugh....

I am sharing my office at work with 2 colleagues. We have an AC unit. Unfortunately I cannot turn it on, because one of my colleagues claims that the draft is too strong and she gets cold and and and...ahhhhh. It's 8:47 am and already 83 degree. Fuck this shit.

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#6 2017-06-01 11:57:29

Augur
Wasted
Registered: 2012-08-23
Posts: 104

Re: Ugh....

Again, I live in South America. It's always pretty warm around here. I'm not talking about a fan in a window, but rather a stationary fan which blows directly to wherever you are sitting, or working. In my case it does help as it's much better to be in moving rather than stationary air. As long as the air is less than 36 C, or 97 F (human body temperature), it does feel better when you have a fan/ventilator blowing at you. Of course an AC feels better if you can stand it and not get sick. I have gotten sick almost every time I have been exposed to AC for a prolonged time (>6 hours), like in some hotels. May be they don't clean the AC filters as often as they should, or turn up the AC too much. Who knows. Still fans do help in hot climates. I couldn't work at my PC during the day otherwise. 3dsmile

As for fans, I'm talking about these:
https://www.google.com.co/search?q=fan& … swmI9WO-M:

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#7 2017-06-01 15:38:20

I. D. Asmith
Tipsy
Registered: 2009-02-25
Posts: 2

Re: Ugh....

If you have a working freezer, putting some ice cubes behind a fan or fans can help.

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#8 2017-06-01 18:41:10

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

Augur: We have a plethora of fans.  They weren't helping in the slightest yesterday.  If you get sick from AC, there is something seriously wrong with the AC unit.  Air conditioning is nothing more than colder air.  What comes out of an AC vent (when the unit is working properly) should be 50-60 degree (Fahrenheit) air... and nothing more.  There's no real way for air alone - no matter what temperature - to make you sick.  (Kill you from exposure, yes.  Make you sick, no.)

I.D. Asmith There's a reason they don't use evaporative cooling in Florida:  The humidity here is already so high that adding more to your environment is not at all comfortable.

Ultimately, the AC guy was able to get the unit back up and running, at least for now.  But it was hell while it lasted.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#9 2017-06-01 23:16:45

Augur
Wasted
Registered: 2012-08-23
Posts: 104

Re: Ugh....

There are two, may be three ways an air conditioning unit may get you sick.
1. Air temperature differential between outside/inside air.
2. Air that is too dry (usually a side effect of AC air).
3. Air filters that haven´t been changed as per the required schedule (air filter trap dust and all kinds of bacteria, and when saturated they start releasing that stuff into the air they blow).

I´m not saying AC is evil. It´s just that in my case I have had some negative experience with some AC units. As for fans, they do help me. 3dsmile Although truth to be told the temperature around here is usually 78-89 Fantasy units, or 26-32 celsius.  Glad you were able to fix your AC at least temporarily.

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#10 2017-06-01 23:48:52

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

Air temperature differential cannot make you sick.  That's a myth.  It's the thing your mother used to tell you about playing out in the cold without a jacket on.  Only pathogens can make you ill.  Air temperature is not a pathogen.  Being in sub-zero temperature naked WILL kill you, from exposure, but it won't make you "sick".  And if your AC is giving you the symptoms of exposure, it's set WAY too low.

Dry air can't make you sick, either.  It makes you uncomfortable, and can lead to nose bleeds, but again, not an actual illness, just discomfort.  There's nothing in dry air to "infect" you to make you sick.  Not to mention if the air from your AC is THIS dry, something is probably wrong with the unit or the installation.  Most AC units aim for 55% humidity or so.  Mine is set at 56%.  But again, I have lived in the deserts of New Mexico, where the summertime relative humidity can drop below 20%.  I did not get sick.  Dry air doesn't make you sick any more than cold air does.  At the very worst, it makes you slightly uncomfortable.  (Not nearly so uncomfortable as air of 90% humidity, in my opinion!!!)

And the third I ruled out when I said that if it was making you sick there must be something wrong with your AC unit.  A filter this dirty IS something wrong with your AC unit.

Not pushing you to use air conditioning, just trying to dispel some myths.  I don't know what happens to you in AC, but if you're actually getting ill, it's not the air conditioner's fault unless the filter needs to have been changed a few months ago.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#11 2017-06-02 00:34:34

Augur
Wasted
Registered: 2012-08-23
Posts: 104

Re: Ugh....

Eric, there are pathogens all around us. So...
1. If you get a thermal shock, or after being very hot you relax in a cold space and get cold in your back, or your extremities, those pathogens may start to flourish. Basically because being cold restricts blood flow to those parts of the body, temperature drops. Less blood flow means less white cells around. Lower body temperature means a better temperature for bacteria or specially fungii to multiply, and less effective immune cells. Both of those circumstances may help get a disease you could avoid otherwise. It´s no coincidence humans have a 36,5 body  temperature which is actually VERY expensive energy wise/metabolically to maintain. A human weight alligator may be perfectly happy eating one or two chickens a month. Humans and endothermic animals in general need much more food/energy. High temperature helps avoid many infections as from a certain temperature up most bacteria and fungii can´t multiply very well.  This is also part of the reason for fever. On the one side higher temperature helps immune cells work more efficiently, on the other side it makes your body a less suitable environment to many possible sources of disease.

2. Cold dry air can make you sick. Bronchitis, sinusitis and other viral diseases may be caused or helped by dry, cold air. All of this additionally to the fact than dried up, or even irritated, or specially bleeding mucous membranes (from the dry air) are more easily infected. It´s just one factor to keep in mind.

3. You may rule it out, but it´s a common occurrence, specially in public buildings and I was talking about my own experience with AC in some  hotels and a few other places. It could be the main reason for anecdotal evidence regarding AC making some people sick. Still, it´s very difficult to study this matter due to the sheer variety of equipment, temperature settings, air humidity level and state of repair/disrepair of the particular AC units being used.


As for using AC I do use it from time to time in my car. Also I may use it in the future in some future house I may build, or such, but I would take into account all the aforementioned factors to get the benefits of AC, but avoid or reduce the negative effects. As I said, I don´t consider AC evil. If you read my first comment carefully, you would see that I said,  that if AC doesn´t affect you badly, of course it feels better than just having a fan.

3dsmile

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#12 2017-06-02 03:12:08

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

Sorry if I seem like I'm trying to jump on you for your negative view of air conditioners.  That is not my intent.

I'm just trying to make sure people don't misinterpret you and start to believe that it is actually air conditioners that make people sick.  At most, you can say air conditioners make people more susceptible to getting sick.  Neither cold air nor dry air cause illness by themselves.  They can only put you in a position where you may be more susceptible to the pathogens that, as you point out, are already all over the place.

As to the dirty air conditioner:  I rule this out because in my original statement, I asserted that a properly functioning unit won't make you sick.  An air conditioner with a filter that needed to be changed last year isn't a properly functioning air conditioner.  Not just from the allergen/pathogen standpoint, but because it is no longer properly doing its job as a cooling unit.  It will run longer than it needs to, and it won't circulate the air as effectively.  So, as a lesson to everyone watching this little debate: Go change your air filter.

NOW!!!!

I'm not trying to assert that you don't feel bad because you've been in air conditioned air.  Just don't put all the blame on the air conditioner itself.  If some dimwit set the stupid thing to 70 degrees F, then yes, you're going to be uncomfortable.  Likewise, if they asked it to reduce the humidity level in the air to, oh, say, 35% or so, then that, too, is gonna make you feel uncomfortable.  But neither of these things by themselves is going to make you sick.

All I can say is, it was 90 in here yesterday.  It's 78 in here today.  I much prefer today.  I will prefer it even more when I can set it down to 75, or maybe even 73, and turn off some of these stupid fans.  (You want to talk uncomfortable... I've never found a fan where I could set it at a distance/power combination where it was always comfortable.  Either it doesn't get me cooled off enough, or it eventually makes me so cold I have to turn it off for a while.  Right now my right arm is frozen from the fan blowing on it.  I just haven't yet gotten annoyed enough to get up and turn it off.)

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#13 2017-06-02 10:32:31

Crusader
Wasted
From: Madison, WI
Registered: 2007-07-19
Posts: 155

Re: Ugh....

"Swamp coolers" = useless in any place.
Went to vacation to Arazona a few years ago, it was in the upper 90s and just comfortable. And that was because there was no humidity at all in the air.

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#14 2017-06-02 13:11:38

Barbarian3165
Completely Blotto
Registered: 2015-02-11
Posts: 329

Re: Ugh....

Low humidity isn't necessarily a bad thing.  Having been raised in a fairly low humidity region, 35% isn't any problem for me.  Although I'd have to check for sure, 35% can be on the high side, at least for the summer and early fall months where I live.  Once the high pressure zone moves over where I live, humidity falls off while the temperature can hit 110+ degrees (late June through early August).  Air conditioning is pretty much essential out here and those that don't have it end up going to places designated to prevent things like heat stress/stroke.

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#15 2017-06-02 16:35:33

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

Crusader:  I know your comment concerning the usefulness of evaporative coolers to be completely false.  I have lived for years with evaporative cooling.  In a dry environment, it works just fine, and adds some moisture to the air, which most people find more comfortable when the outside RH is like 20%.  I'm not sure how to interpret your comment about Arizona being "just comfortable" in the upper 90's.  Are you saying that you were comfortable without any form of air conditioning?  Or that you found evap. cooling to be "just comfortable" when the temp was in the upper 90's?  If the former, then you're weird, and that's all there is to that.  I grew up in the Southwest, and virtually no one was "comfortable" outside when the temp was in the upper 90's, not even the guys who had to work out in it.  You tolerate it, you don't enjoy it.  If you're referring to evap. cooling being "just comfortable" when the temp was in the upper 90's, then... well... what more did you expect it to be, than comfortable?

Barbarian:  Not sure where you live, but it sounds pretty much like the places in NM that I lived.  Summer RH factors below 40% pretty much all the time, dropping below 20% on the hotter days...  Able to actually go outside when the temp is 104 without worrying about keeling over from heat stroke just because you went for a walk...  And while I personally agree that 20% humidity isn't uncomfortable, I grew up with it.  Most people are going to find that 35% RH is pretty dry, and 20% is downright intolerable.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#16 2017-06-02 17:41:50

Tuzzdeny
Inebriated
From: Florida
Registered: 2015-05-17
Posts: 13

Re: Ugh....

I'm a big fan of "swamp coolers" in the south-west were humidity is very low and on some points it's even superior to AC.
I even had portable swamp cooler in some of my cars when I lived in Albuquerque and Alamogordo NM.

But 90% of the time I would take refrigerated air (central cooling).  It reduces humidity, a big plus in most places!  Plus it also does a great job of pulling pollen and other irritants from the air, I believe particles  get trapped in the condensing water. 

I run my AC in NE Ohio spring/winter/summer and fall on and off just for relief from allergies, my wife likes it cool but I walk around with a sweater in June.   Florida without central air would be a good working definition of purgatory for me.

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#17 2017-06-11 18:41:56

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

Question:  What's worse than Florida in the middle of June?

Answer:  Mowing the lawn in Florida in the middle of June.

*gasps from back pain, aspirates his own sweat and drowns*

UGH.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#18 2017-06-12 08:43:38

Sniper
Inebriated
Registered: 2016-07-04
Posts: 94

Re: Ugh....

You just cover everything with concrete and paint it green, problem solved.

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#19 2017-06-12 12:43:29

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

Until the city finds out and forces you to rip up the concrete, since that violates city ordinance...

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#20 2017-06-13 06:31:00

Sniper
Inebriated
Registered: 2016-07-04
Posts: 94

Re: Ugh....

You always seem to be able to find the fly in the ointment. Just like my wife. Then you most likely also won't like my other ideas, like getting a goat.

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#21 2017-06-13 12:42:52

Augur
Wasted
Registered: 2012-08-23
Posts: 104

Re: Ugh....

Make a japanesse sand garden out of your lawn. You just need some herbicide, a little sand and some rocks. 3dsmile

Seriously though if it really is a problem for you, there is always the possibility of buying a robotic lawnmower.   They aren´t cheap (from 650 dollars up depending on the model), but at most you would just need to launch an app on your phone.
3dsmile

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#22 2017-06-13 12:55:06

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

You want to donate the $650+?

I just spent $7500 yesterday (not to mention only getting about 4 hours sleep the night before - damned daywalkers...) having a new air conditioner installed in this dump.  (At least now it's a cold dump, instead of an insanely hot dump...)

And you forgot the part about the guide wire that most of those robotic mowers use to determine where your lawn ends.  You know, the thing I'd have to bury?  I might as well bury me about halfway through, 'cause my back would be dead.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#23 2017-06-14 12:59:23

Augur
Wasted
Registered: 2012-08-23
Posts: 104

Re: Ugh....

As I said, it is kind of expensive. Although a regular lawnmower still is over 200 dollars, so that´s relative. And you said you have just installed a 7500 dollar AC in your house. 600 looks like peanuts in comparison. But I do get it, as my own budget is still pretty limited and restrictive. For example, we don´t have any AC at home at all as I can´t justify the expense in our case. We also don´t have a Tv as we watch almost all programs via streaming services. Would be nice to have one, but it isn´t actually necessary. May be it would be nice to change the radio in the car for one that could play mp3, or had an external audio jack, but again, not a really necessary expense, more like a somewhat nice luxury. And so on. That´s life for you. Most people are forced to prioritize on how they spend their income.  In your case there is always the possibility of installing the previously mentioned Japanese sand garden. 
3dsmile  3dsmile
Again, may be you should think about the automatic mower option I mentioned. Expensive and all, but if you health doesn´t allow you to mow the lawn anymore, or it´s getting progressively more and more difficult, you have very few options. Either eliminate the lawn in some way (concrete, sand, gravel, or other methods), start contracting the lawn mowing services from someone at the cheap (may be some kid in your neighborhood), or get a robotic lawnmower. All of those options have their own price-tag.

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#24 2017-06-14 18:21:21

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 5742
Website

Re: Ugh....

Yeah, let's point out that I didn't "pay for" the $7500 air conditioner.  It ALL went on credit of some form.  And in order to pay for that, you might notice I've upped the monthly donation goal on the website.  This was a necessary expenditure:  You don't live in west-central Florida without air conditioning, unless you like going to the hospital.  I have no idea how people did it before A/C, other than that they were older, and thus much less active.  (Not that I'm a marathon runner, mind you, but I do try to get up and get things done around the house as much as I can...)

And my "health" (It's just my back, not my health) didn't STOP me from mowing the lawn.  It just punished me for doing it.  And the thing about such things is, if you do, in fact, reduce your activity level because of them, they get WORSE, not better.  Your back muscles atrophy even further, and whatever problem is causing your back to hurt is only exacerbated.  What I NEED to do is be MORE active (which would make my back hurt even worse), so I can lose about 80 pounds or so, which would help my back immensely.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
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#25 2017-06-15 01:58:17

Augur
Wasted
Registered: 2012-08-23
Posts: 104

Re: Ugh....

Can't argue with you there.   Being more active IS good. 3dsmile Good luck Eric.

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